Rann announces police will have the power to crush "hoon's" cars.

http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,25780859-5006301,00.html

Wow, what a massive waste of money. Now instead of selling off the vehicle to genuine car enthusiasts who don't break the law and using the money to give to victims of crime or driver education, the tax payer will fund the crushing and disposal of (often expensively modified) cars.

Opinions?

I thought they were only going to crush low value cars and sell the others off for the victims of crime fund.

 They should sell them off. Crushing them is a huge waste.

 Would be more punishment for the 'hoon' seeing it driven around I reckon.

Just remove the word "cars" from the law for a perfect solution

I, for one, applaud this maverick thinker, and await his suggestion of Money Hole farms to fix this damn economic crisis as well. Think of all the labour created from these wonderful ideas. Broken windows for all!

How many fatalities this year have been caused by street racing? From memory it would be around 5.
How many fatalities have been caused by drink driving, fatigue, inattention, failing to give-way, etc.? ALOT MORE, why are their cars not being crushed?

"These repeat offenders are hell bent on driving dangerously and engaging in anti-social behavior," Mr Rann said."
They don't crush drink drivers cars, is this because its more socially acceptable?

This is an absolute disgrace and just another example of Rann lapping up to the issues the media push to gain votes.

SA - the state that bases its laws on what sells newspapers

as much as i want to laugh at all the waaaahhhs going to be had by the bell-ends that own these cars, crushing the cars is a bit stupid - why not strip them and sell the spare parts?

still has the desired effort of 'destroying' the customised cars theyve put effort & $$$ into building
employs someone to pull them apart
makes some cash back


but again, if you can legislate for this, why cant you legislate to ban these dickheads owning these sorts of cars?

I like how he even mentions in the article that "this will send a message to a VERY SMALL GROUP IN OUR DRIVING COMMUNITY.

I notice that these laws will also make drag racing a criminal offence, which seems like a load of crap seeing as drink driving isn't. You're a danger to yourself and everyone else no matter what speed you're traveling while drunk.

The State Govt should be thinking about why these kids are always doing this sort of thing on the roads now. Could it be that it's because there is absolutely NOWHERE in SA where it can be done legally?

It appears the SA state government is now run out of the Advertiser Now offices on Waymouth St... all decisions are based on Adelaide Now comments and polls. Importance is determined on how many comments can be made in a day, with a follow up story in the same paper the next day stating the community outrage, based on said comments.


Drink driving IS a criminal offence. I agree that street racing should be a criminal offence, with jail time even... but 'hoon' laws are just stupid. Laws can't be based on a label that is open to interpretation & opinion.


If only it was possible.

Edit: back to the crushing thing, that motoring journo got caught doing 230km/hr in a Ferrari California a few days ago, they impounded the car for a week and he's been charged with a number of offences... but what gives the state government the right to crush a half million dollar super car

at the same time though, if there was some way of measuring:
a) the total number of actual drag racers (probably more than we think but still a fairly low number) and
b) the total number of drink drivers (probably more than we think again, but also a much much higher number than the drag racers)
then compare them to the number of deaths caused by each, i'd put money on drag racing coming out looking a lot worse.

inattention, fatigue and failing to give way are signs of poor driving, not outright deliberate fuckheadedness

Nothing gives them the right; normative ethics are not solid and natural law is a myth. The entire joy of democratic statesmanship is discovering which arbitrary powers you can wield under the auspices of demagoguery. In that regard, the man does fine work. I, for one, appreciate a leader who has worked out the rules of the game.

Actually, very few fatalities are caused by these - accidents yes, but few fatalities.

Speed and alcohol are the biggest cause of death on roads. End of story.

I think this is pretty funny.  I love the rules of society, work hard, earn a decent living, build a house, buy a car and put your children through school but if at any stage you use that money we forced you to earn in a way we (as a governing body) don't like then we'll simply take it away from you!  I understand they have the power(thank you greyskull) but do they have the right to simply take your possesions(even though they are perfectly legal). I think the same issue arises with drug busts. Sure you cant grow hooch but cops busting down your door and taking your hydro gear is akin to home invasion.

Rambling I know but its a little disappointing that we live in a world where if the cops don't like the book your reading to your child they can take it away from you!(exaggeration I know but wheres the limits)

Ah right, I thought it was only a criminal offence once you were a certain amount over the legal BAC limit. My mistake.

I wonder if these laws will increase the amount of high speed pursuits we have though? I mean with the new punishment, if you're driving a highly modified car and see those red and blue lights start flashing in the distance behind you, do you slow down and pull over or increase your speed even higher and try lose them?

Not saying I'd do this btw, I'm well past my driving like a fuckwit days.

Government has never been one to pay attention to the Law of Unintended Consequences before.

High speed chases will probably increase, but you just wait until that happens and then create new arbitrary powers to punish this new problem even more severely. I'm sure you can even fund some people to print a study that shows only the positive statistics from your new legislation as well. Everybody loves the aura of veracity created by statistics, and nobody has even the slightest clue about the subject of statistics, so that will cover some more bases. The system works.

Rann is playing populist politics with the public during the lead-up to the election. End of story.

This is typical, short-sighted political manipulation for more votes and it boils my blood. It is very easy to pick on bikies, hoons, drug users etc - any piss-easy scapegoats to utilise in order to detract public attention away from their weak, egotistical and selfish agendas.

Imagine the up-roar if drinking alcohol regulations, road laws and social clubs were targeted by Rann and Atkinson's iron fist?


LOL

Yes, but it is democracy, so both sides do this as a matter of game theory optimal strategy. I say get on board with the most entertaining and self serving side, and personally Rann's game plan seems far more self-conscious and well devised at the moment.

Jesus, Game Theory hey? What a load of bull dust IMO. Yes, it can illustrate how people, including individual politicians act... But that theory does not sit well with collectivist sensibilities and action.

Rann's game plan is on for good reason. He might lose.

It doesn't sit well with collectivist sensibilities on paper, but seeing as a bunch of collectivists are taking part in this game funded by, and with the winner decided by, the collective, I'd say their posturing and point scoring is sitting fine with them.

Besides, revolution is violent and sanguinary, and seasteading is a pipe dream; pick a team Alana.

I think that's right, but you can't exactly criminalise someone for being at 0.06 when being at 0.05 is perfectly fine and legal.

"I'm going down in a blaze of glory"

 

edit: Nah, you know me; I take up the sweet spot - somewhere pragmatically in the centre (left).

That's exactly right, so at which point do you start criminalising drivers for speeding? Does circumstance come into it? If you are doing 150km/h in a 110km/h zone in the country are you deemed as a criminal hoon driver who is engaging in street racing or are you just speeding?

How the hell do laws which are so open to interpretation get passed?

Ah, the joys of having a state government with no opposition party.

Another option I saw mentioned somewhere was using the vehicles for crash testing. That'd be better than selling them off in some ways, less likely that another 'hoon' gets ahold of the car...

Pseudo Coup: I don't think I've seen funnier responses to threads on AM than yours in this thread for a long time. Good work!

warped fairy, thank you for the idea. There is now an official emoticon.

Richie your observation about where our state government is really run through is so appropriate, especially when you look at the lead up to the State Election... Unfortunately as Noddy has pointed out there is no credible opposition.

 

Well you don't criminalise someone who's doing 116km/h in a 110km/h zone, but you do criminalise someone who does 150km/h in a 110km/h zone*.





*I have no idea if this is actually a criminal offence or not, but it's not really relevant.

I reckon the police should build some crazy modified drag car and then race the hoons for pink slips.

Take their car and embarrass them at the same time.

 

yessss! i was wondering where that came from!

Drag? Why not have a proper race track. Cops in their Commodores and hoons in their Rice Rockets.

Have two identical tracks. The cops drive one and the hoons on another. The one for the hoons is lined with stobie poles.

Maybe so - But what constitutes a "hoon"?

Is 116km/h in a 110km/h zone evidence enough of "hoon" activity for the police to take your car and crush it?

Is a well off business man/woman speeding in his/her stock bmw/merc still classified as a hoon or is it just young people in modified cars?

   

But what I'm getting it is, is that person out in the country a 'hoon driver' or just someone who is speeding? Is the lady paying more attention to her kids in the back and her phone than the tank of a 4x4 she is driving and what's happening around her, whilst traveling 15km/h's over the limit labled as a 'hoon driver'? Because I'd be willing to bet more people have been killed under these circumstances than by 'hoon driving'. While 'hoon driving' is stupid, at least they're generally paying attention to one thing and one thing only, the car they're driving.

To me it just seems like a law brought in to give cops the right to harass a certain group of people.

Law is like tax, it's not meant to be logical.

I'll take that bet!

I'll give you $1000 if you can prove this. You give me $1000 if you can't.

Deal?

How do they define hoon?  Someone who regulalry speeds? does more than one car have to be involved(ie drag)? Drives drunk or under the influence? How do they decide who is a hoon and who is you everyday offender? Does a hoon have to be under a certain age?

Sounds like balatant prejudice(to young peeps) to me.  Cant imagine too many speeding grampas getting their caddys squashed or mum racing to get the kids to school getting her 4x4 pancaked.

I am in no way a hoon, however the state govt bringing in laws like this certainly makes me think twice about wanting to live here/bring kids up here/support the state/work here.

Welcome to the worlds largest retirement village.

You know those 'HEAPS GOOD' shirts?

You should get some printed that say 'WORLDS LARGEST RETIREMENT VILLAGE' instead, or 'RANN CRUSHES CARS'.

I'd buy one.

Maybe they should just add the alco pops tax to fast cars!

Agreed. SA has always been the most conservative area due to religious migrants and aristocrats who 'founded' this state. With our aging population, aged politicians and future projections of our demographics = it is going to get so, so bad. However, politics and baby boomers aside, there are 'heaps' good things about SA...

And yes, I know it's you're and not your. I didn't make it

  whambulance alert

wheres the cunt at the end saying "my fucking cat is still stuck in the tree mike rann" ?

Its so true though.  My little bro got a glass smashed into his face and when the cops got there all they did was help the offender flee the scene. Fucker still isn't locked up and they know where he lives!

Sorry, what?

I understand cries of incompetence, but there seems little incentive for cops to aid and abet petty criminals. 1 rather obvious disincentive as well.

we all know someone who has suffered some miscarriage of justice of some sort;
i had a mate who got seriously injured in a hit and run, cops knew who it was, but somehow the case got fucked up by the guy semi-admitting it in a cop station before he was connected to the hit and run and got fucked on some legal technicality.
or how about Ian Humphrey, killed by that 'hoon' Eugene McGee driving @ 150km/h and pissed?

really, that pic just sums up a bunch of bitches having a cry that they are too easily caught.
if you dont want to pay big fines, lose your licence and risk getting your car crushed, then dont drive your car like a fuckhead on public roads - really elementary stuff here folks

It suffers the obvious logical hole that all reported speeding cases are caught on camera, or by the eyes and laser gun of a cop, and cars carry obvious identification. If rapists and murderers had a number plate nailed to their ass and had a penchant for attacking people on public roads I'm sure those cases would be much easier to solve.

no shit.
stick to the rules. not fucking hard, they're all there for a reason, however lame it might be...

+1

im not too sure why people are defending people who are racing on the street and going twice the speed limit

Oh god, don't say that, the Rann might get the idea of branding criminals!

Do you know where lives?


I don't think you'll find anybody in here actually defending people doing twice the speed limit engaged in street racing. More so we are picking on the law as it's so open to individual interpretation and just seems like another excuse for Police to target young people on the roads.

Plus, crushing these cars rather than selling them off is just a huge waste of money for everyone involved.

definitely a waste of money, but has selling off the cars been deterring anyone?

Hey this hasn't actually been clarified anywhere, but are they going to leave the hoons in the cars when they crush them?

Crushing is no greater deterrent than selling. Either way that person no longer has the car they used to own. People don't continue to drag race under some misapplied sense of charity towards people who aren't them.

The only positive in favour of crushing is the new level of farcical entertainment democracy in this state is elevated to every time our esteemed leader makes absurdly arbitrary and counterproductive decisions. Though, as long as it doesn't effect me any more than a decision from the opposing party would, I can't help but feel that this positive is a particularly strong one.

I agree but their incentive was to keep the peace while they were there. Mother Fucker was in a private residence and the police were out front preventing people from entering. When they finally got around to knocking on the fuckin door(an hour after arriving) glass man was no where to be found(shock).  They were doing their job but in doing so they prevented the natural justice the 'mob'was trying to hand out.  (I know I'm bitter and bias but my little brother had his face cut up so its justified).


Trying to find out!
Police wont even tell us when court cases are but they've been nice enough to send us a letter telling us about the last three times the case has been adjourned!

Apparently everything changes because it happened in a pub and not on a street.  Have to have people willing to testify that they saw everything as there is no evidence that he didn't do it to himself(cause drunk people in pubs do that kind of thing).  A friend got glassed a few years back and even though it was on camera guy still didn't get locked up.  Its some crappy loop hole.

Maybe refinement in these areas of law could serve as more use to society than crushing some kids car!

 + eleventy majillion bazzillion

 And what if they do quantify it? Where has it been said it's open for interpretation?

 

They have introduced the law without setting any guidelines as to what constitutes a "hoon". This is why people are understanding it to be open to interpretation.

This is not right as it allows police to have the freedom to change the rules depending on their emotions/feelings/thoughts at the time. Don't get me wrong, there are complete fuck heads on the road, but police should not have so much power without a governing body to keep them in line.

There is so much wrong with the SA govt it is not even funny.

hoon = road terrorist

Do they crush cars in any other states? Or any other countries?

Maybe there is just a higher rate of infection by Toxoplasma gondii among today's youth.


The Return of the Puppet Masters

In a post from a few years ago titled, Do you love cats?, I wrote this:

Toxoplasma gondii is a favorite parasite of evolutionary biologists because it has an incredible property.  The parasite lives in the guts of cats where it sheds eggs in cat feces that are often eaten by rats.  Now how to get back from the rat to the cat?  Amazingly, Toxoplasma gondii infects the brains of rats making them change their behavior in a subtle way that increases the genetic fitness of the parasite.  Toxoplasma makes the infected rats less scared of cats and so more likely to be eaten!

Now here is the kicker.  Toxoplasma gondii also infects a lot of humans.

Now here is the latest research finding;

Toxoplasma gondii infects 20–60% of the population in most countries...We confirmed, using for the first time a prospective cohort study design, increased risk of traffic accidents in Toxoplasma-infected subjects...Our results show that ...subjects with high titers of anti-Toxoplasma antibodies had a probability of a traffic accident of about 16.7%, i.e. a more than six times higher rate than Toxoplasma-free... subjects.

People with RhD blood factor have some protection - see the article for more.  No word yet on whether this increases the probability of being eaten by cats although I suppose it would have to.

Posted by Alex Tabarrok on July 18, 2009 at 07:20 AM

I blame Taxidermy Ghandi

Yes, that Toxoplasma gondii is a crazy one , turns people nuts supposedly. Really, however, all you need to do is wash your hands after a session of "how many "playful" claw marks will you give me today" with your cat. Or stop them from killing things, which is more difficult.
I took a leisurely walk home from town to mine early Sunday morn. No "hoons", no taxis, very few cars. Just the birds in the trees and fresh air. In the shoes of someone who has enough money to get a taxi home, or drive a car, it was a good option, though I couldn't imagine doing it every day, it just happened to be meteorologically choice that morning. Anyway, Toxoplasma gondil would render the sufferer inable to grasp the consequences of not having a car anymore. If they get caught doing what they enjoy more than anything in the world, making lots of engine noise, spinning rubber down to the rim and going really really fast. Then they may look forward to walking everywhere, riding a bike, public transport or taxis.
Soon, you then might have these same people challenging people " I'll race you to the top of the hill, as they tighten the laces of their runners." Or they could give the taxi drivers extra money to drag their friends, in another taxi alongside them, from each set of lights all the way home. 
Personally, getting naked and frisky with single women, is much more fun, than tragically "short-ending" the lives of others or myself in a car. 
 

I agree, being a dip shit on the roads is good reason to be punished. I think the issue is more the crushing/wasting of cars/money.  Also I think it comes across as quite weak. Like the government cant be bothered doing anything better with them. Surely even from an environmental standpoint this is wasteful as well!