Ableton LIVE - Tips & General Discussion

This thread is for technical discussion on Ableton LIVE....  :gheyslay:

Someone else please start some threads for Cubase/Logic/Pro Tools etc.

Feel free to suggest some discussion topics. There are alot of people new to LIVE so lets keep it simple folks...

This thread is for technical discussion on Ableton LIVE.... 

Someone else please start some threads for Cubase/Logic/Pro Tools etc.

Feel free to suggest some discussion topics. There are alot of people new to LIVE so lets keep it simple folks...

(http://www.ableton.com/r1/pages/live_7/tour/home/banner.png)

www.ableton.com (http://www.ableton.com)

Check out some tasty new features....

  :lolslayer:

www.ableton.com

Check out some tasty new features....

 

i can make loops ok. where the hell do i make my arrangements?

                                                                                                                                            _
Top right of the screen, there is a button that is like this in a circle   III   and another like =

the horizontal one makes it like a basic arrange window - switch between those
                                                                                                                         

Pressing the TAB key switches between the two modes - CLIP mode and ARRANGEMENT mode.

You can drag a clip and hit TAB at same time!

very handy.....

Also, if you want to just JAM OUT and record it, hit F9 and play, then trigger the clips realtime, they will be recorded to the arrangement view automatically, in this way you can record and entire improvised set.

Khem, can u sticky this thread plz?

:yup:

Ok, so I suppose we need to cover some basics with LIVE before we start going too deep down the rabbit hole....   

I've been using LIVE since version 1 and one thing I picked up quickly is how much easier it is with MIDI control. For making tracks a MIDI keyboard is a must, preferably with knobs & sliders for CC control as well as note input. For DJ/Live Sets something more substantial is needed as you are going to have a McFukload more clips/buttons/sliders/toggles to trigger. So...what to buy and how to configure it?

Personally, I don't have the $$$ to shell out for a high end console control such as the Mackie Control or Digi Design setup, so I went for a much cheaper option. Not usually known for quality gear, i settled upon a Behringer BCF2000 (yes, normally Behringer suck), the cheapest motorised fader MIDI controller on the market. Don't get me wrong there are some kickarse controllers out there, but I wanted something compact and portable, this fits the bill nicely. You can pick up one of these puppies for just a smidge over $300 new. I won't cover all the features but will point out that this unit is USB and classic MIDI connectable and has footswtich and foot pedal inputs as well. As i wrote in the previous Ableton thread the footswitch is paramount to my whole LIVE setup. The ability to use your feet & hands at the same time opens up a world of possibilities.

I'd like to cover some other controllers people are interested in, as well as controller emulation within Live (i.e. making LIVE think my BCF2000 is a Mackie CONTROL).

Another great feature of LIVE is the ability to map computer keyboard keys to buttons/knobs. This is handy if you aren't fortunate enough to yet own a nice MIDI controller. More on this shortly.

Soon I will cover configuring MIDI options for use with your favourite gear. MIDI control has changed dramatically during LIVE's evolution, so please state what version of LIVE you are using when asking about MIDI in LIVE. Most other functions are same in all versions.

When mixing with live i find it really hard to get my tracks to sync. It used to be fine, just click on the track and away you go. now i can't get them to start at the right bar. I'm sure I've probably changed the settings somehow (I know which ones do it) but i can't seem to get it back to the ease of use i had before.

what settings would you use for live mixing?

Ok, Leezee I will cover this in depth at some point. There are some tricky things that can happen here.

The short version goes like this:
 
To get absolute accuracy for mixing tracks you need to place the markers yourself instead of relying on LIVE's inbuilt beat detection algorithm. Remember...LIVE is primarily a sequencer not a dedicted DJ program. The algorithm is very good, but the human ear is always better.

You need to place the first WARP MARKER in your clip on the first beat of the song. This doesn't necessarily have to be at the start of the track. You can zoom in a long way in the clip view, so locating an actual kick drum is easiest bcoz the attack transient is easy to spot which makes placing the marker alot easier (good for when you have a track with a long ambient start). You can reposition the Play marker in negative bars/beats once the first marker is set, so you still utilize the ambient part of the track while making sure it stays in time.

Once the marker is set correctly, turn on the metronome and play your clip. While the clip plays adjust the ORIG BPM in the clip by typing in values, you will hear the metronome click going in and out of sync. Once you have the metronome clicking ok skip the song forward, this will NOT affect the placement of the beats, merely it lets you skip forward through the track to make sure it's in time further down.

image not archived: Immagine%204.png

Once the track is working with the metronome click the save button in the clip. Every time you bring the clip into LIVE now it is in tempo automatically!

This is like getting a record out of your crate and beat mixing it PERFECTLY....ONCE.......then having it automatically beatmixed every time you pull it from your crate in the future !!!!

 

yeh i've done that.

I just can't get my tunes to start exactly when i click em. i usually have to click the button to move them back/forward a beat after i've got them running. I used to be able to consistently start them in time.

Ahh okies.

You have the Sample Start Marker in the wrong spot.

Inside the clip view there are warp markers, loop points and the play marker. You prolly have the warp markers and the loop points right but you must have the play marker not snapped on a beat properly. Since most tracks you put the first warp marker on the first beat it follows that the play marker should be in the same spot.

In this pic you can see the Sample Start Marker in the middle of the sample.

image not archived: 033warpmarker5.png

Move it so it snaps to your first warp marker.

Also, as i mention just before, if your first warp marker is NOT at the start of the song, you can move this Sample Start Marker into negative beats & bars to make the song start where you want it to while still retaining BPM sync.

there u go aye.... 

nah ah!

I'm clicking on the spot where i want to start the track, it's just that i used to be able to click on the beat/bar and it would start instantly. now i've changed something and there is a delay before it starts, usually just one beat. To get it synced i have to click it about one beat before i want it to start, which is annoying.

Are you clicking inside a clip or an arrangement?

Sounds like you've mucked with some quantization settings. Is your global quantization set to 1 BAR (default) or something else.... or possibly NONE?

image not archived: 09.png

There are also per-clip quantization settings, these give a clip its own quantization seperate from the global one.

Without seeing your screen its a bit hard to guess, but i reckon this would be in the ballpark.

 :beat:

I just whipped up a quick mix in about an hour, using reasons auto warp thingo. I was actually surprised how well it worked, there was only one song I needed to fix that was playing at about 280 bpm. I havn't actually been bothered to sit down and work out how to do it manually though.

 

Was pretty mad. The actual thingo said the song was at 80 bpm, and the master tempo was at 90, and for some reason it played it ridiculously fast. I might upload it later if my dial up lets me

Yer the algorithm in the program doesnt nail it 100% of the time. It sometimes detects double or half speed. or close to..

A quick way to double or halve the original clip tempo is to use the *2  and :2 buttons seen below (c).

(http://www.ableton.com/r1/pages/tips/2004_05/04ClipViewWithTempo.png)

Yer the algorithm in the program doesnt nail it 100% of the time. It sometimes detects double or half speed. or close to..

A quick way to double or halve the original clip tempo is to use the *2  and :2 buttons seen below (c).

Yeah I actually tried using the half and double time things and it didn't work. A bit random problem is I can't remember what I did to fix it, I just played around for a bit.

Those of you having probs with sync'ing tracks and cant remember how u fixed or fukt it here's a small tip.

Every audio file LIVE has analyzed will have an accompanying file of the same name except it has .ASD at the end of it. This is where all the Warp Marker/Clip tempo/Settings are stored for that clip. Delete this file and drag the audio back into LIVE again and have a second go at getting it sync'ed.

Moving an analyzed track from one computer to another? ....dont forget the .ASD file.

Rename your source audio?......rename your .ASD file as well !

Sounds like kids stuff, but it's really easy to forget. Those of you who have a desktop and a laptop and make most of your stuff at home then go play out with a lappy might wanna bookmark that in ur brain. Last thing u want is to rock to a gig with a set full of un-analyzed files....

You can also tell in LIVE's browser whether a track has already been analyzed or not. If it has it will have a little tick on the waveform next to the filename.

I worked out how to precisely adjust songs tempos now, although it can take a while to do it all yourself. It's actually quite similar to Logic Pro's beat thingo.

Schweet. I've not touched Logic for a long time...

Metronome does help alot.

 :biggrin:

Schweet. I've not touched Logic for a long time...

Metronome does help alot.

 

I'm clicking on the waveform display down the bottom. It's a quantization issue. u know what the original settings are? They worked perfectly, but i changed them when i was doing other things.

Okies, so the clip independent quantization must have been mucked with. The pic in the last post was the global quantization. You need to change the quantization for that clip only.

In the launch options for the clip (make sure little L light is on) you have the options:

(http://www.ableton.com/r1/pages/tips/2004_11/figure_06.png)

This is so you can change the launching of clips independant of the global quantization. I think is maybe what you need to change. Put it back to global or 1 Bar.

 :spin:

I'm clicking on the waveform display down the bottom. It's a quantization issue. u know what the original settings are? They worked perfectly, but i changed them when i was doing other things.

Okies, so the clip independent quantization must have been mucked with. The pic in the last post was the global quantization. You need to change the quantization for that clip only.

In the launch options for the clip (make sure little L light is on) you have the options:



This is so you can change the launching of clips independant of the global quantization. I think is maybe what you need to change. Put it back to global or 1 Bar.

 

Hi! I'm wondering how the hell do i automate the panning? I've made a sound scape in ProTools (ocean theme), with the sound effects in Ableton. I need to move the sounds from left to right etc for some realism... Help!?

Thanks

p.s - this is for a uni assignment lol

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w116/nerddog_69/trackpan.jpg)

Simply change the drop down boxes under your audio track to mixer and track panning, and then you can either select the pencil tool (top middle near the play controls) or leave it unselected and click to make points and drag etc in the same way you would with most automations.

Also what uni you going to and what course? I probably know you if your doing this kind of stuff.

image not archived: trackpan.jpg

Simply change the drop down boxes under your audio track to mixer and track panning, and then you can either select the pencil tool (top middle near the play controls) or leave it unselected and click to make points and drag etc in the same way you would with most automations.

Also what uni you going to and what course? I probably know you if your doing this kind of stuff.

Diploma in Sound engineering Adelaide uni - do you know me??? One of 2 girls in my course i'm the non hippy looking one

Im sort of doing bach of music studies majoring in tech, but I dropped everything else except tech, and even now I don't really go because the I think the coursework is a load of shit. I'm the guy with the afro if it makes a difference.

:lol:  i must say i had a similar experience with the c4.  as far as i can tell the diploma is a lot more interesting...

  i must say i had a similar experience with the c4.  as far as i can tell the diploma is a lot more interesting...

alright now that's out there - i met a friend of yours last night when talking about music technology she referred to you also as the guy with the afro... adelaide may be small but that was fucking weird!

i've finished the degree. i agree that what you learn may seem like a load of shit if you want to make music like drum and bass and the like. depends what you want to get out of it really. i've found that i've been able to relate alot of what i've learnt back into my production now especially the synthesis side of things. in my first year of the degree and even in parts of the c4 i was pretty annoyed at alot of the shit we had to do but by the end of 3rd year i was loving it especially the tech stuff not the classical theory though...

hahaha. pretty much everyone refers to me as that. I think im one of the people in adelaide with one. Who was it you were talking to? (sorry bout the massive off topic here)

i dont particularly want to make dnb for a living, I would teach myself if I wanted to that. I was more interested in the whole recording studio aspect.

same.  which is why i'm still not over making the wrong decision on whether to study the C4 or the diploma

Lets keep the thread to LIVE related stuff guys.....

Anyone else got any questions or comments?

Ok, so a few ppl have asked me lately about warp markers... getting them right and so on.

Instead of ranting on and on I found a You Tube vid that explains it all pretty well. This is a must see for anyone who wants to DJ with LIVE in any capacity, as you really have to pre-analyze your tracks properly for it to work well. Most ppl I speak to who are new to LIVE understand the theory behind this perfectly but have trouble executing it. Hopefully by the end of this vid you'll be a master at it.

LINK - Ableton Live WARP MARKERS - The Hard Way

 

Ok, so we all know speed is of the essence, right? We all get bored when working out the software takes over from a mad jam session. Ask any true Geek or I.T. professional and they'll tell you - "Know your keyboard shortcuts." This applies with 99.99% of programs, so why not spend a few minutes and make your life that much easier.

So... here are the most useful shortcuts for LIVE (based on Version 6). Consult the PDF manual for complete descriptions.

If anyone is still unsure what these mean feel free to ask.   

---

CTRL+1: Reduce time grid resolution.
CTRL+2: Enlarge time grid resolution.
CTRL+3: Toggles triplet mode on and off.
CTRL+4: Disable grid, no snapping.
CTRL+5: Disable grid zoom lock, no snapping.

CTRL+B: Switchs between pencil and pointer editing tools.
CTRL+D: Duplicate selected blocks.
CTRL+E: Splits midi/audio blocks.
CTRL+F: Follow play timeline.
CTRL+I: Insert silence.
CTRL+J: Consolidate midi/audio blocks.
CTRL+K: Edit key map.
CTRL+L: Sets markers and loop around selected time.
CTRL+M: Edit midi map.
CTRL+R: Rename track.

CTRL+DEL: Delete only selected automation channel dots.

CTRL+X,C,V,O,S,N,A: Cut, copy, paste, open, save, new, select all options.
CTRL+ALT+C,V,X,D: Copy, paste, cut & duplicate envelope automation.

CTRL+T: Insert new audio track.
CTRL+SHIFT+T: Insert new midi track.
CTRL+ALT+T: Insert new return track.

CTRL+SHIFT+D: Duplicate selected time.
CTRL+SHIFT+M: Create midi block in the selected area.
CTRL+SHIFT+R: Render loop.
CTRL+SHIFT+DEL: Delete selected time.

F1/F8: mutes and unmutes mixer channels 1 to 8.
F9: Record ON
F11: Switch to fullscreen mode.
F12: Switch between vst and fx and midi block panel.

---

you rock

... now... for ProTools... type up all 30-odd pages of shortcuts please! :p

oath, maximal kudos to the spreading of the knowledge... ye have inspired at least i, will have to make some sticky material for the massive

edit: so much for on topic *clips tongue*

Ha...AS IF   

Pro Tools ain't my game.

There's plenty more LIVE nuggets of wisdom to come yet tho......   

Well I have already had a bit of a spiel about Follow Actions and how fun they are. They certainly can bring out some creativity where it was lacking before by randomizing (or not) clip launching. A great way to make your own amen breaks or just generally fuck with a drum loop etc...

Well this has been covered in a downloadable PDF from the Ableton clan.

Get it here -> Follow Actions.pdf

I'd like to touch on something a friend asked me about preserving play position while using follow actions. He was basically making his own amen breaks using very short (1/2 bar or 1/4 bar) loops and triggering them with follow actions. His problem was that he wanted to switch between the audio clips (can do this with MIDI clips too) but he wanted the samples to start playing where the last one left off instead of the new clip starting from the beginning.

Introducing LEGATO mode.......


LEGATO tells LIVE to launch each new clip from the play position of the last. This sort of requires the clips to be the same length but is not mandatory, LIVE will play the clip from wherever the loop would be if it had played for the same amount of time as the previous clip, very smart!

But......what if I have 50 clips in my Follow Group ? You mean I have to switch on Legato for each one seperately?

HELL NO! - We like to do things the speedy way around here. Select the top clip in your group by double clicking it (you'll see either the audio or midi for that clip in the bottom half of the screen).
Now scroll down to the bottom clip in the group. Hold the SHIFT key and select the bottom clip. You have now selected all clips in the group.
As you can see in the bottom display.... only parameters that are common to all clips are now displayed. Legato is one of these. Now turn Legato on, this now applies to all clips you selected. Presto!

This is a handy technique for modifying the same parameter for many clips. I often get part way through a track and realize that I actually wanted Legato or some other parameter changed but can't be arsed going to every clip and changing it.

---

edit: I mentioned my friend was using 1/4 length bars to make his breaks. You will notice that the launch options follow the Global Quantization unless specified in the clip properties. To switch the clips more quickly you could either: 1. Change the Global Quantization (not recomended) or 2. Change the quantization of each clip. Using the same multi-selection technique described above you can easily change your group of clips to quantize to smaller amounts of the bar independant of the main quantization. Amen breaks are a good example of when you might need to do this.

---

For anyone who uses LIVE and Reason together (or any other Host sequencer for that matter) might want to check the Reason 4 thread.

I came across a handy PDF made by the Ableton crew about using the 2 products together using ReWire. Some very good tips including how to route signals directly to the Reason hardware interface and bring them separately into LIVE.

Those of you too lazy to go to the Reason thread can go here.... I guess..... (you know who you are!)

-> Tips Tricks Reason.pdf

since i dont have decks over here ive had a bit of a play around with ableton

this tutorial is pretty handy to get you up and running if you wanna check it out

http://kapsil.net/stuff/Mixing_with_Ableton_Live_Tutorial.pdf

Yeh nice one Khem.... that's a pretty good intro for LIVE n00bs.

Covers everything that was in the video posted previously.

Earned urself a gold star m8 

Does anyone have any specific questions regarding LIVE?

I am prepping some more goodies that i'll post up in the next day or so.

Also would be good to hear what everybody is doing with it, maybe we could start a repository of forum members tracks? (anyone wanna donate some FTP space?  )

Maybe a good way for those bedroom producers to get some DJ's to play their tracks out? - e.g. Patch + Serato =


Watch this space.....

im currently using ableton, rewired into logic7.   Mainly for looped breaks cos its just sooooo easy.

I tweaked the electro kitty vocals with ableton too.  great for sample manipulation.

But, im so used to logic for everything else. i could never convert.

Peace.

Puremagnetik releases FREE Micropak FX for Ableton Live.

Well anyone whose used PureMagnetik LIVE addon packs will know they are always of good quality. This ones free which makes it all the better.

image not archived: puremagnetik.png

Puremagnetik is pleased to announce the first in their line of Artist Signature Series Micropaks. Puremagnetik has teamed up with Australian producer Neon Stereo to create 35 expertly crafted audio effect racks for Ableton Live.

With remixes for heavyweights such as Steve Angello, Andy Caldwell and DJ Ricky Stone alongside a big line up of upcoming original productions on premiere labels such as System Recordings, 852 Records and DJ Zimbardo's Benchmarc Records, in 2007 Neon Stereo has claimed his place as a world class producer.

Better known to the Ableton Live community as 'sweetjesus', for the last 3 years he has been an internal tester for Ableton, an active member of the community and regarded as one of the foremost experts when it comes to Ableton Live.

Ok crew, I recently found a skin editor for LIVE that i didn't know about.

As well as some handy info about where to put them once you've created them.



Ableton Live Skin Editor - http://sonictransfer.com/ableton-live-skin-editor.shtml

Adding Skins to Ableton Live - http://sonictransfer.com/adding-skins-to-ableton-live.shtml

If anyone makes some funky skins......  post em up! (use attachment feature).

Well I've read alot of other forums lately and I saw a tutorial on another forum that's of interest to those of you that don't have the most powerful computers but have more than one (or at least access to).

MIDI over LAN. - Utilising MIDI over a standard ethernet network.

Source - Ableton Live Fans Community Forum

Read it here - http://www.ableton-live-fans.com/forum/showthread.php?t=91

image not archived: gmmidilogo.gif

This is a good forum for LIVE n00bs as well....

For all you MAC owners that use LIVE (require Pluggo runtime)

http://www.defectiverecords.com/majormalfunction/index2.html



Sytem requirements:

Macintosh
- G4 667 MHz or greater, PowerPC or Intel (Universal Binary)
- Mac OS X 10.3.9 or greater
- Ableton Live 4.x or greater (earlier versions may work, but not tested)
- Cycling '74 Pluggo, Pluggo Jr, or Pluggo Runtime, 3.6.1 or greater (Pluggo Runtime is free)

This looks like it has definitely taken its inspiration from the free VST for PC called GLITCH - http://illformed.org/glitch/



This should keep some peepz happy for a while.....

Leveling, meters, and many other topics along the way... - By Tarekith (http://tarekith.com/)

http://tarekith.com/assets/Leveling.html

Here's a fairly straightforward guide to basic mastering techniques using LIVE. For those that have never studied Audio Engineering this is a good entry point to audio analysis.

nice one 

Ableton LIVE 7 is now available for puchase

Now.... to see if Father Christmas will buy it for me.......

Just wondering, can these programs (abelton/serato/final scratch) record your set to PC as you're playing it?

Or do you still need to go out to another external source when recording?

FunkyJ, yes you can do this with Ableton Live. Hit F9, jam out your set and every clip & midi automation is recorded as well. You can then save and render it as audio later.

Final Scratch allows recording of output audio or automation. Not sure about Serato, but I am sure it would record at least audio out.

an audio designers dream, i think the midi map segments on any session can be exported  too yeah ?

im after a copy of albeton pm me if u can help

I'm droppin in during the week to say g'day Sarg...

7

I know Devious uses it and he's getting shit signed left right and centre. Maybe speak to him simmo

unstickied - keep it bumped if you need to make any abletone related posts