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Internet censorship in Australia

Started by Rookie · 25 Oct 2008 · 127 of about 361 posts survive · see it on the Wayback Machine

AuthorMessage
nathoPosts: 3,572
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 10:17amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
What a load of shit. Can they actually fucking do that? Do we live in China now or something. Just block anything that the government doesn't want us to know. Since it's at ISP level there would be no way to get around it hey.
StrykeSuper Hyper-Mega
Posts: 6,118
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 10:23amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute

 Not keen.

 :(
When I die. I want to be frozen. And if they have to freeze me in pieces, so be it. I will wake up stronger than ever, because I will have used that time, to figure out exactly why I died. And what moves I could have used to defend myself better now that I know what hold he had me in.
RookiePosts: 1,006
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 10:56amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
What a load of shit. Can they actually fucking do that? Do we live in China now or something. Just block anything that the government doesn't want us to know. Since it's at ISP level there would be no way to get around it hey.

burn down all the ISPs

or

bribe ISPs for unrestricted 'premium' access
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 11:17amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
1. Look at Labor's history of proposals vs what actually gets done...

2. Try the following: cup your hands and have someone fill them with water. The water is the internet's safe material. Now have someone drop a few drops of blue dye into the water. That's the internet's unsafe material. Now let some water through without letting the unsafe material through. That's about how this type of filtering will work.

3. If this does go through (doubt it, and if it does it'll take years) it will take us back to 15 years in Internet technology. Filtering all traffic the way they want to do so will put huge strain on ISPs. Look at their budget. It's a tiny 125 million dollars. If they wanted to do this properly they'd need to throw millions directly to every single ISP and every single data carrier in the country to put filtering systems in place. Those businesses are not going to like that and they will fight against it.

4. Politicians have no idea about the internet. This is the equivalent of saying "we need to filter the streets to prevent bad guys driving from one place to another, so lets put a roadblock and checkpoint on every street in the country".

Take the above points into consideration and you'll realise there isn't much to worry about at the moment.


PS. People keep bringing up China or other countries like that. Their filtering systems don't work very well at all. If someone wants to get information, they will get it.
nathoPosts: 3,572
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 11:28amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
I could still see them bringing something like this in regardless of how well it works. The example you used is good. It means you get a bit of unsafe material, but also lose a lot of safe material. Just seems fucking ridiculous to me.

Oh and I was just using China by example due to their policies on stuff like that (not because of their actualy filtering system)
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 11:33amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
I could still see them bringing something like this in regardless of how well it works. The example you used is good. It means you get a bit of unsafe material, but also lose a lot of safe material. Just seems fucking ridiculous to me.

Oh and I was just using China by example due to their policies on stuff like that (not because of their actualy filtering system)

Yeah fair enough.

If anything I am against it not because I think it will work effectively enough to be of any hindrance, but precisely because it will be so ineffective that it's a complete waste of money.

If they really wanted to 'save the children' (that's the regular argument) they'd just do the same thing as what Howard did and pay for or subsidise net nanny type software for families that want it. At the end of the day though, it's the parents responsibility to look after their kids and not the federal governments.
nathoPosts: 3,572
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 11:41amSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
We really are turning into a nanny state though. Even the stuff like raising alcohol prices to tackle binge drinking. If we want to destroy our bodies isn't that our own choice. Things like this have a negative effect on the majority who don't abuse the system as well. You also can't shelter kids for ever. Even if you block kids internet at home they will always have friends etc. who have access to 'naughty' material.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 12:01pmSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
We really are turning into a nanny state though. Even the stuff like raising alcohol prices to tackle binge drinking. If we want to destroy our bodies isn't that our own choice.

Sure it's your own choice, but if you do that and then need medical attention precisely because you've destroyed your own body what is unfair about you paying for more of that attention through the increased taxes you've paid on your drinks?

Anyway it's probably a topic for another thread. :)
nathoPosts: 3,572
Posted: 25 Oct 2008, 12:05pmSubject: internet censorship give oli a minute
Yeah wasn't trying to derail. It's all been said before anyway.
deathmazePosts: 3,010
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 4:02pmSubject: Internet censorship in Australia
So does anyone think this compulsory internet censorship is really going to happen? Pretty sure 2/3 of the population will take to the street with pitchforks if it does!

I know the government is doing it to keep independent mp's on side, but I don't know why they think they'll be able to get away with it  :cuckoo:


Australia's compulsory internet filtering 'costly, ineffective'

THE Federal Government is planning to make internet censorship compulsory for all Australians and could ban controversial websites on euthanasia or anorexia.

Australia's level of net censorship will put it in the same league as countries including China, Cuba, Iran and North Korea, and the Government will not let users opt out of the proposed national internet filter when it is introduced.

Broadband, Communications and Digital Economy Minister Stephen Conroy admitted the Federal Government's $44.2 million internet censorship plan would now include two tiers - one level of mandatory filtering for all Australians and an optional level that will provide a "clean feed", censoring adult material.

http://www.news.com.au/technology/story/0,25642,24569656-5014239,00.html
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oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 4:19pmSubject: Internet censorship in Australia
Pretty sure 2/3 of the population will take to the street with pitchforks if it does!

No they wont. Most people will just hear the 'protect the children' argument and think it's fine, or they won't give a shit.

Australia's level of net censorship will put it in the same league as countries including China, Cuba, Iran and North Korea, and the Government will not let users opt out of the proposed national internet filter when it is introduced.

Same league? That's bullshit. It would make us far worse than those countries.

Why? Because the populations of those countries had no choice (they're not democracies). A democracy gets the leadership and policies it deserves.
deathmazePosts: 3,010
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 7:35pmSubject: Internet censorship in Australia
No they wont. Most people will just hear the 'protect the children' argument and think it's fine, or they won't give a shit.

Normally I would agree but this seems a bit different. They're going for the anti-euthanasia and anti-anorexia reasons rather than anti-porn. On sunrise this morning at least 80% of the vote was against it... and kochie didn't like that  :lol:

Same league? That's bullshit. It would make us far worse than those countries.

Why? Because the populations of those countries had no choice (they're not democracies). A democracy gets the leadership and policies it deserves.

A democracy gets the leadership they choose, but would the Liberals have done something different? I think this time they've gone too far... even though I don't want to access the stuff they say they'll ban, and I don't think naive and brain damaged teenagers should be able to access the pro-anorexia websites, just knowing that the government is limiting information (i.e. knowledge) makes me feel like I don't live in a democracy.... fuck that!

I can't believe it's not Liberal  :E
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oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 9:50pmSubject: Internet censorship in Australia
Normally I would agree but this seems a bit different. They're going for the anti-euthanasia and anti-anorexia reasons rather than anti-porn. On sunrise this morning at least 80% of the vote was against it... and kochie didn't like that  :lol:

I don't think it makes any difference to be honest. As long as the argument contains the 'think of the children' argument it can go through.

A democracy gets the leadership they choose, but would the Liberals have done something different?

Yes they would have done something different, in fact they had already done something different while in office which was far more sensible: they'd offered subsidised versions of software to individual families who wanted to protect their own children. After all it is the
parents job to parent the children, not the governments...

I think this time they've gone too far... even though I don't want to access the stuff they say they'll ban, and I don't think naive and brain damaged teenagers should be able to access the pro-anorexia websites, just knowing that the government is limiting information (i.e. knowledge) makes me feel like I don't live in a democracy.... fuck that!

I can't believe it's not Liberal  :E


Why can't you believe it's not Liberal? These types of blanket policies (state is always better at making decisions than the individual after all, if you subscribe to their general ideology) are far more typical to the Labor party than to the Liberals in my opinion.

How do you know you don't want to access the stuff "they say they'll ban"? They won't even have a public list of what will be on the register so for all you know they might be blocking lots of politically oriented material you might want to access. You'd be crazy to think that after the 'think of the children' argument they'll just keep blocking more and more information that they don't like...

what will they be banning?

(just curious)

Nobody will ever know for sure because as mentioned above they won't have a publicly available register showing what they are blocking.
delPosts: 3,160
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 10:27pmSubject: Re: internet censorship give oli a minute
Fuck all this for a joke. If they do this, then at least introduce something to ban ads from Foxtel and legalise weed...


PS. People keep bringing up China or other countries like that. Their filtering systems don't work very well at all. If someone wants to get information, they will get it.

Yea, that's fine - but I don't want a hassel when I want to look something up. I just want it to be there, that's what makes the internet good.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 10:31pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Yea, that's fine - but I don't want a hassel when I want to look something up. I just want it to be there, that's what makes the internet good.

Yes, I agree. I was just mentioning it because in the press they like to sensationalise the issue even more by comparing us to those countries without acknowledging that the systems don't actually work that well wherever they're implemented.

If this goes ahead I am going to (within the law) put something together (a site) encouraging a concerted campaign to disrupt the whole filtering system with bogus reports or something like that to prove how stupid the whole thing is.
John LPosts: 3,007
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 10:35pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Yeah its a load of shit.

Was good to see the "Wednesday All Starts" or retards on Sunrise this morning saying they thought it was complete bullshit that the govt was even considering this, and every time Kochy tried to arc up and agree with the govt they shot him down. He really showed how clueless he is when it comes to the "Internet". He seemed to think it was just to stop kids from viewing porn and stuff.. DEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRRR IDIOT.

SUCKED IN BALDY.
Get off my lawn.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 11:09pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
In case you hadn't guessed I feel strongly about this issue. :E
delPosts: 3,160
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 11:24pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
If this goes ahead I am going to (within the law) put something together (a site) encouraging a concerted campaign to disrupt the whole filtering system with bogus reports or something like that to prove how stupid the whole thing is.

Good, I'll join in.

Just be prepared though that if someone you know that you probably wont know in 20 years decides to run for prime minister, this action may count as ant-government/terrorism and hurt their campaign :E


Oh, and I hate Kochy.
LeezeeThe right honourable
Posts: 3,309
Posted: 29 Oct 2008, 11:44pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
It's fucked up.

1. Won't work. Heard of this http://www.torproject.org/ ? No, of course you haven't, there is no need. But soon the mainstream will learn about it because they will want their rights back.

2. It will slow down your internets.

3. No one knows what will be blocked, so we won't know if it's just child porn sites or all sorts of crap.

4. There will be an "opt out" part, but some internets will be completely blocked, even if you opt out.

5. Gay.
nathoPosts: 3,572
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 8:12amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
It's fucked up.

1. Won't work. Heard of this http://www.torproject.org/ ? No, of course you haven't, there is no need. But soon the mainstream will learn about it because they will want their rights back.

I use Tor occaisonally. Problem is unless you find a good proxy it's slow as hell. If more people starting using it there's going to need to be more people hosting as well.
FunkyJPosts: 4,503
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 8:13amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
what will they be banning?

(just curious)

basically anything that is deemed illegal or offensive - stuff that would be given an X or RC rating if it was "published"

So hardcore porn, child pron, anything about the making or selling of drugs, how to commit suicide, information on abortion, information on money laundering, any kind of "hate" speech, and that kind of thing.
QuazzaPosts: 13,620
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 9:29amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
not tube8.com??


*raises clutched fist* noooooooooooooooo!!!
undergroundBass Element
Posts: 861
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 9:54amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
no more porn, the internet will now be useless :E
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oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 9:55amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
There was a discussion about this on ABC Radio this morning. Glad to see this is slowly getting more and more coverage and public scrutiny by people with a clue. :yup:
JayarPosts: 3,532
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 10:48amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
its all a very slippery slope, and a path that really shouldnt be gone down.
first the net - then what, start adding more books to the banned list?

interesting can of worms though, like is it cool to have bomb-making stuff on the net? and who deems what offensive? if the koran offends me, can i have all passages that refer to it blocked? im sure a lot of christians would find many philosophers/thinkers offensive to their beliefs - block them too?

if its about stopping children accessing pron, then leave it as the parents responsibility and stop treating us all like kids... soon enough therell be free filters you can download just like virus scanners to use at your leisure.


Why can't you believe it's not Liberal? These types of blanket policies (state is always better at making decisions than the individual after all, if you subscribe to their general ideology) are far more typical to the Labor party than to the Liberals in my opinion.

what, like previous federal government deciding they knew best and overturning the NT euthanasia laws? ;)
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oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 11:39amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
what, like previous federal government deciding they knew best and overturning the NT euthanasia laws? ;)

NT isn't a state, so you have to be a bit careful when discussing Fed. govt intervention in 'their' laws...

In relation to this debate the Liberal government's policy of providing software to parents who wanted it made a lot more sense.
EzPosts: 4,532
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 11:44amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
smells like the beginnings of propoganda to me

I can see it now. The Labor party blacking out the Liberal party website.
John LPosts: 3,007
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 11:48amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
smells like the beginnings of propoganda to me

I can see it now. The Labor party blacking out the Liberal party website.

Errr thats not what propaganda is...

1.    information, ideas, or rumors deliberately spread widely to help or harm a person, group, movement, institution, nation, etc.
2.    the deliberate spreading of such information, rumors, etc.
3.    the particular doctrines or principles propagated by an organization or movement.


Its Censorship.
Get off my lawn.
headachePosts: 7,887
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 11:48amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Welcome to the peoples republic of Australia...
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EzPosts: 4,532
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:02pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Errr thats not what propaganda is...

1.    information, ideas, or rumors deliberately spread widely to help or harm a person, group, movement, institution, nation, etc.
2.    the deliberate spreading of such information, rumors, etc.
3.    the particular doctrines or principles propagated by an organization or movement.


Its Censorship.

I know what Propoganda is. I said smells like the beginnings of it! Never said it actually was.

i.e. the Government blacklisting things they dont want you reading & putting up things they do want you to read by doing this under the banner of "censorship".

However, now I see that my half arsed example wasnt the greatest.
undergroundBass Element
Posts: 861
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:10pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
 :lol:
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EzPosts: 4,532
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:12pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
 :lol:

awesome
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:29pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
What pisses me off the most is that it all started as an 'opt in' filter to make it harder to access child porn or content unsafe for children.

Then it became an 'opt out' filter to do the same thing, meaning people would manually have to contact their ISP to opt out.

Then it became a blanket system with two levels of filtering and no option to opt out.

Then it became a blanket system to protect against the above as well as topics like anorexia, euthanasia, suicide etc sites.

How far are they going to try and go?

Earlier I introduced this analogy: This is the equivalent of saying "we need to filter the streets to prevent bad guys driving from one place to another, so lets put a roadblock and checkpoint on every street in the country"

I have thought about a better way to describe it. The above implies that the roadblocks will cripple transport but will still catch bad guys. I should have said this: These policies are the equivalent of implementing a road block on every major road (any roads with 2 lanes or more for example). Anyone could get around them easily if they wanted to or knew how (take side streets). All traffic would be slowed down, and the system would still let lots of the bad guys through, because they'll take side streets as well.

The irony behind all this is that Stephen Conroy's title is "Broadband, Communications and Digital Economy Minister".
A few points relating to his title:
1. Broadband - this will take us back to where we were 10 years ago (in terms of speed and price, since ISPs will need more support staff to deal with a stream of people asking "why can't I access this site?") for Internet access, in particular if these filtering systems are very aggressive. Tests they've publicly released have indicated that with aggressive filtering traffic can be slowed down by 80+ percent.
2. Communications - see above.
3. Digital Economy - nice way to completely stifle the "digital economy", just as more and more people are buying online they go and put something in place that will be a huge disincentive to do anything online because it will be so much slower, and because the number of false positives will probably mean lots of legitimate sites will become inaccessible.
deathmazePosts: 3,010
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:39pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Then it became a blanket system to protect against the above as well as topics like anorexia, euthanasia, suicide etc sites.

The pro-anorexia sites are disgusting though, and it would be good if there was some way to stop people harming/killing themselves due to the misinformation they obtain from these sites.

But that's why I think they've used it in their campaign to promote this system.... it's so emotive and people do want to do something to protect others who don't know how to protect themselves.

I still can't see this system actually being implemented though. They'll probably do the old Howard trick of saying the most extreme option, then after everyone kicks up a stink they'll change to a slightly more moderate option, and we''ll accept it even though it's still too far all say how reasonable the government is!  :E
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oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:46pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
The internet has disgusting material available if you want to find it.

Fixed that for you.

Hey look! It's just like real life! ;)
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:49pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I wonder how many people in the christian lobby groups are actually porn addicts in denial. :E
John LPosts: 3,007
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 12:58pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
What pisses me off the most is that it all started as an 'opt in' filter to make it harder to access child porn or content unsafe for children.

Then it became an 'opt out' filter to do the same thing, meaning people would manually have to contact their ISP to opt out.

Then it became a blanket system with two levels of filtering and no option to opt out.

Then it became a blanket system to protect against the above as well as topics like anorexia, euthanasia, suicide etc sites.

How far are they going to try and go?

Earlier I introduced this analogy: This is the equivalent of saying "we need to filter the streets to prevent bad guys driving from one place to another, so lets put a roadblock and checkpoint on every street in the country"

I have thought about a better way to describe it. The above implies that the roadblocks will cripple transport but will still catch bad guys. I should have said this: These policies are the equivalent of implementing a road block on every major road (any roads with 2 lanes or more for example). Anyone could get around them easily if they wanted to or knew how (take side streets). All traffic would be slowed down, and the system would still let lots of the bad guys through, because they'll take side streets as well.

The irony behind all this is that Stephen Conroy's title is "Broadband, Communications and Digital Economy Minister".
A few points relating to his title:
1. Broadband - this will take us back to where we were 10 years ago (in terms of speed and price, since ISPs will need more support staff to deal with a stream of people asking "why can't I access this site?") for Internet access, in particular if these filtering systems are very aggressive. Tests they've publicly released have indicated that with aggressive filtering traffic can be slowed down by 80+ percent.
2. Communications - see above.
3. Digital Economy - nice way to completely stifle the "digital economy", just as more and more people are buying online they go and put something in place that will be a huge disincentive to do anything online because it will be so much slower, and because the number of false positives will probably mean lots of legitimate sites will become inaccessible.

All good points..

As I understand it it will also be up to the ISP to supply all of the hardware to do this filtering, the govt is going to put in place laws and the ISP has to go out and purchase all the necessary hardware to do it.

The side affect of this IMO is that we will have even less choice as far as ISP's go as a lot of them won't be willing to fork out the cash to pay for the additional hardware.
Get off my lawn.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 1:04pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
That's what I understand from what I've read/heard as well. Those that won't be willing to fork out the cash will go out of business. Those that are willing to fork out the cash will end up charging us a lot more (justifiably so), hence my comment about going back 10 years in speed and price.

I'm going to write to my local MP soon to introduce him to these analogies. I honestly think that none of the people who are for this system have any idea what so ever about computer networks or how the Internet functions... Of course you can't expect them to know about everything, that's why they have advisors. But don't they have advisors in these areas that are telling them the way it is? I am puzzled...
deathmazePosts: 3,010
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 1:18pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Fixed that for you.

Hey look! It's just like real life! ;)

Actually that's not what I meant  :nahnah:

Normally you know when your accessing something disgusting, but this is potentially deadly information disguised as "normal" and aimed at people who lack reasoning skills as they've already be brain damaged from malnutrition. Although these people could obtain some of the info from other sources in real life, they wouldn't be able to obtain all of the dangerous info because afaik it isn't listed anywhere else. But the most logical solution would be education rather than censorship I guess.

I'm going to write to my local MP soon to introduce him to these analogies.

I think lots of people (even non-internetty people) will do the same, and the government just doesn't realise how many people are against it (in this form). It is very puzzling!
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oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 1:27pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Actually that's not what I meant  :nahnah:

Normally you know when your accessing something disgusting, but this is potentially deadly information disguised as "normal" and aimed at people who lack reasoning skills as they've already be brain damaged from malnutrition. Although these people could obtain some of the info from other sources in real life, they wouldn't be able to obtain all of the dangerous info because afaik it isn't listed anywhere else. But the most logical solution would be education rather than censorship I guess.

Hehe, OK.

Anyway I agree with your 'logical solution' comment. Pity politicians don't think logically...
deathmazePosts: 3,010
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 1:30pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Crudd is a total hypocrite.

I hate it when people call him Crudd.... I call him Ruddy the Robot  :)
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afterdarkPosts: 11
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 1:49pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
From Crikey today (crikey.com.au):

Conroy a fearless combatant in the war against free speech

Canberra correspondent Bernard Keane writes:

Estimates isn’t what it used to be. Way back when, sessions could go all night and public servants would frequently be waiting until 3am to have the likes of Bronwyn Bishop bully and insult them.

Sometime in the Keating years, they reduced the annual number of sessions from 4 to 3. In more recent times, they ended sessions at 11pm, adding a faint sense of civilization to proceedings. Then, in the last years of the Howard Government, as part of its manic determination to curtail any accountability, Estimates was made shorter, so that politicians had to rush through their questions or place them on notice. Labor has not been inclined to restore the more languorous approach of previous years.

To make things worse, there aren’t that many Coalition senators interested in taking a patient, forensic approach. Simon Birmingham is one, but then he has a brain and uses it, which puts him way ahead of a lot of his colleagues. The likes of George Brandis and Michael Ronaldson fancy themselves as inquisitors but don’t measure up. But the Greens senators do, because accountability is their bread and butter and Estimates is their chance to shine.

Which makes the exchange between Senator Scott Ludlam and Minister for Delaying Things Stephen Conroy and his officials on internet filtering last week especially interesting. Asher Moses has written about the exchange for the Herald, as has the estimable Stilgherrian here. Ludlam was conducting his first Estimates hearings and impressed immediately. Old head, young shoulders, that sort of thing. Hopefully he will spend much of the next six years making life most difficult for the Government.

The Ludlam-Conroy exchange is worth examining in detail because in it Conroy showed all of the reasons why he and his Department are not to be trusted on the internet filtering issue.

You could tell Ludlam got under Conroy’s skin pretty quickly because the Minister, who normally enjoys Estimates and is never short of some banter, rapidly defaulted to his now-standard suggestion that anyone quibbling with the Government policy on regulating the internet is a paedophile.

The immediate cause was Ludlam’s insistence on asking what other countries had mandatory ISP-level internet filtering. The answer, among democracies, is zero, but clearly Conroy and his officials didn’t want to admit that. Several times Ludlam tried and each time he got the runaround. First he was disingenuously told by an official that the UK, Canada, New Zealand and the Netherlands had ISP-level filtering, which prompted Conroy to say "this is not some one-off excursion," about his own policy.

But Ludlam homed in. What countries had mandatory filtering? That’s when Conroy suggested Ludlam might like child pornography. He wasn’t deterred. What countries had mandatory filtering? "We are looking at the opt-out provision," Conroy immediately replied, as if making a bid for non sequitur of the week. Perhaps aware that it was also complete rubbish, he continued "it depends on which way you are looking at it."

Presumably, as in, looked at another way, it’s not "opt-out" at all.

"It can mean the opposite of what it sounds like, so it does get a little confusing," he continued. That indeed confused Ludlam, so much so that he momentarily forgot that Conroy had entirely ignored the question. But eventually he backtracked to it. Which countries had mandatory filtering? "The situation across the countries actually varies quite considerably," averred Deputy Secretary Abul Rivzi. Actually, that’s not true about mandatory filtering. Actually, no one else has mandatory filtering. Actually, Conroy wasn’t telling the truth when he said "this is not some one-off excursion." Rivzi explained the UK situation in some detail, before eventually adding that, um, it was voluntary. Actually.

Senators 1, Public Servants 0, to use a sporting analogy the Minister would understand.

Of course the real score is about Government 6, Free Speech Zilch, because Conroy is well advanced in plans to impose a filtering scheme that is not, despite Conroy’s claims, just intended to block material of the sort currently banned by the Australian Communications and Media Authorities’s wholly useless blacklist of websites.

Conroy keeps asserting that any claims he wants to censor the internet are hysterical misreporting. But when pressed, he and his officials start dancing around the issue. When Ludlam tried to tease out what specifically would be blocked under mandatory ISP filtering, Conroy first tried to head him off by claiming that everything was still up in the air. "You are jumping ahead of where we are actually at in the development of it." "We are just at the very early stages. You are actually jumping ahead." "We are actually only in the early stages..."

Actually.

When that doesn’t help, Conroy goes to his default position: he’s just trying to block what’s illegal anyway. "We would be enforcing existing laws," Conroy told Ludlam. And "I am not looking to blanket-ban some of the material that it is being claimed I want to blanket-ban, but some material online, such as child pornography, is illegal," he told The Age today.

Well that’s OK then. Who can object to blocking what’s already illegal?

Do you know what’s illegal on the internet under Australian law? It’s not just child pornography or bomb-making manuals. Any material classified RC or X18+ by the Classification Board is outright banned – which includes non-simulated sex (and even simulated sex, and for that matter anything dealing with "intense adult themes" is banned if access isn’t restricted).

This means material that is available in bagged magazines in newsagents across the country is illegal online. Makes sense huh? Despite the claims of Conroy’s officials, the UK doesn’t have such a nonsensical online restriction.

Don’t like porn? Well, gambling is banned too. Australian sites, that is – we haven’t yet moved to an outright ban on access to overseas gambling sites, but Nick Xenophon wants us to.

If you’re still relaxed, are you aware that, under changes introduced by Phillip Ruddock, "counselling suicide" on the internet is a criminal offence? Despite claims to the contrary from the Howard Government, this was directly aimed at stifling debate about euthanasia and the work of euthanasia support groups and campaigners. And despite the fact that, as Electronic Frontiers Australia has pointed out, the suicide rate has fallen since the internet became widely available.

To say nothing of Australia’s reflexive support for music and film multinationals’ draconian attempts to prosecute file-sharing.

And under Conroy’s filtering scheme, all of these restrictions have to be interpreted by a bureaucrat when deciding whether to ban a website, or perhaps ban whole ranges of content based on keyword searches.
But Conroy refused to even discuss how much "overblocking" of content he would regard as inappropriate.
Too early to say, actually.

The real worry here is that there is no science or evidence-based policy for what is blocked online in Australia. The Howard Government’s decisions on stifling free speech online were based on moral panics, not well-considered policy. The Rudd Government will be no different. The role of Nick Xenophon and Steve Fielding, who wants to impose his own warped sexual morality on the rest of us, will be important to a Government that relies on their votes in the Senate.

But they’re not the main problem – the Government itself is. And Conroy is working overtime to keep the Government’s assault on free speech out of sight as much as possible.
headachePosts: 7,887
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 1:54pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I wonder how many people in the christian lobby groups are actually porn addicts in denial. :E

I saw him the other day near my mates place (his dad lives next door) and he looks about as Christian as I do. Was wearing a Chicago Bulls jersey, a pair of air force 1's with tats all over his arm. Thought it was fkn Quaz at first :lol:
more kicks than Daniel-san and Mr Miyagi
EzPosts: 4,532
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 2:51pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
HAHA @ Ruddy the Robot

Love it !

 :lol:
dubbdPosts: 2,314
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 8:33pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
not tube8.com??


*raises clutched fist* noooooooooooooooo!!!


*note to self... go to tube8.com when i get home from work...*
Thou shalt not use poetry, art or music to get into girls pants | Use it to get into their heads.
cleverPosts: 202
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 8:46pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I am sure that being able to look at porn on the internet has stopped many people from actually going out and committing rape because they have had a safe way to release their sexual urges.

It might sound a bit extreme but there are people out there who are incapable of controlling such urges, and denying them access to release their built up "frustration" in a safe way will only lead to other means being sought to release said built up "frustration".

That being said i'm sure the internet censorship issue is not so much about porn but more about the governments being able to further "dumb down" their citizens by being able to control what information they receive so they don't find out what's really going on in the world. This already happens with what we see on TV so it's no surprise that the internet would be the governments next target.

 :E
LexyPosts: 6,599
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 9:06pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I am sure that being able to look at porn on the internet has stopped many people from actually going out and committing rape because they have had a safe way to release their sexual urges.

It might sound a bit extreme but there are people out there who are incapable of controlling such urges, and denying them access to release their built up "frustration" in a safe way will only lead to other means being sought to release said built up "frustration".

Rape isn't about sexual urges. It's an act of violence and it's about power.
myloPosts: 1,027
Posted: 30 Oct 2008, 9:12pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Fuck I'm worried. I'll just SSL to an unrestricted proxy or use a terminal server.

Another epic fail for the government :lol:
Lurk moar
EzPosts: 4,532
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 10:06amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Internet Censorship = increase in rape?

Yeh that really makes sense.

oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 11:00amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Internet Censorship = increase in rape?

Makes about as much sense as thinking that internet censorship will stop people who want to access 'certain content' able to access that content. ;)
RefusePosts: 1,034
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 11:11amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Old Ruddy might loose a few votes if this shit passes.
This could be the start of something bigger, lets hope not.

Looks like back to the old porn shop cos the internet won't be giving us free porn anymore.
image not archived: SanAntonioSpursLogo.gif
bezzPosts: 956
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 11:12amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Makes about as much sense as thinking that internet censorship will stop people who want to access 'certain content' able to access that content. ;)

makes about as much sense as internet censorship itself.

'by your logic I could say that this rock keeps tigers away!'
NoddyPosts: 9,559
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 11:21amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
There are a few people on here who's posts I would love to have censored from my internet.
Testing the limits of the human heart since 1973.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 11:24amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Old Ruddy might loose a few votes if this shit passes.
This could be the start of something bigger, lets hope not.

Looks like back to the old porn shop cos the internet won't be giving us free porn anymore.


There are a few people on here who's posts I would love to have censored from my internet.

Yeah, like posts that break our not so loose rules about people who lose at life because they get lose/loose wrong... :E
LeezeeThe right honourable
Posts: 3,309
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 3:49pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
 :mad:
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 31 Oct 2008, 4:01pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I can hear your blood boiling from here Leezee!
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 1 Nov 2008, 3:47pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Leaders of Australia's 3 largest ISPs explain why filtering won't work and is a stupid idea:
http://www.zdnet.com.au/insight/communications/soa/ISP-level-content-filtering-won-t-work/0,139023754,339292158,00.htm

Critics of Conroy's Internet filtering say Australians will not be able to find out what the government censors online, and ask: who watches the watchmen?
http://www.computerworld.com.au/index.php/id;355409327;fp;16;fpid;0
Fluke.~Daft Punk~.
Posts: 7,841
Posted: 1 Nov 2008, 4:17pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
There are a few people on here whose posts I would love to have censored from my internet.


wow, a few of you missed it.
Straight Edge since 1994.

Dyslexics are teople poo.
RefusePosts: 1,034
Posted: 1 Nov 2008, 8:35pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Oh no look out it's the fucking spelling police :beat:

Reading and writing were never my best subjects
image not archived: SanAntonioSpursLogo.gif
Fluke.~Daft Punk~.
Posts: 7,841
Posted: 1 Nov 2008, 8:47pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
nah only cos Noddy is anal about it, i pointed it out.


i personally dont GAF
Straight Edge since 1994.

Dyslexics are teople poo.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 17 Nov 2008, 2:52pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I think they're going to try it for 'realsies' but when they finally realise how stupid the idea is and how ineffective it is they'll give up.

Nothing will be lost, except for millions in tax payer dollars. Which is no big deal since nobody is accountable anyway.
dubbdPosts: 2,314
Posted: 18 Nov 2008, 12:59amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
so is the govt. carrying out this stupid policy for realsies?




hopefully they censor the phrase "for realsies"
Thou shalt not use poetry, art or music to get into girls pants | Use it to get into their heads.
DaTBird187You think you're Pimp?
Posts: 1,826
Posted: 18 Nov 2008, 1:27amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
 :lol:
Rob FrostPosts: 2,683
Posted: 18 Nov 2008, 6:05amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I think they're going to try it for 'realsies' but when they finally realise how stupid the idea is and how ineffective it is they'll give up.

Nothing will be lost, except for millions in tax payer dollars. Which is no big deal since nobody is accountable anyway.

Stupid socialist labour Government and their stupid internet filtering
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 18 Nov 2008, 10:54amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia

hopefully they censor the phrase "for realsies"

Then this site would get taken off line. :(
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 19 Nov 2008, 4:37pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/11/11/1329222&from=rss

I love this: Quoted from the article: 'Every time a kid manages to get through this filter, we'll be publicizing it and every time it blocks legitimate content, we'll be publicizing it.'
cleverPosts: 202
Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 10:23amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Rape isn't about sexual urges. It's an act of violence and it's about power.

Of course it's about violence and power...which stem from a persons inability to control their sexual urges.
LexyPosts: 6,599
Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 11:44amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Of course it's about violence and power...which stem from a persons inability to control their sexual urges.

It doesn't stem from a person's inability to control their sexual urges. A man's sexuality is not a separate entity over which he has no control. Rape is a choice, men who rape *choose* to rape.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 12:20pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
What gives Lexy? You seem to know more about male sexuality than me. I barely get it, let alone female sexuality. :E
LexyPosts: 6,599
Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 12:39pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
What gives Lexy? You seem to know more about male sexuality than me. I barely get it, let alone female sexuality. :E

:lol:
JayarPosts: 3,532
Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 4:04pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
It doesn't stem from a person's inability to control their sexual urges. A man's sexuality is not a separate entity over which he has no control. Rape is a choice, men who rape *choose* to rape.

sexual violence 101.
violence that uses sex as a weapon, nothing to do with sexual urges.
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LexyPosts: 6,599
Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 10:00pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
sexual violence 101.
violence that uses sex as a weapon, nothing to do with sexual urges.

Precisely.
FunkyJPosts: 4,503
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 10:55amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
They had a story on this on 7:30 Report last night. What REALLY annoys me is the morons they get to say things like "if it stops some illegal child porn, isn't that better than none?"

errr, NO.

This filter will do NOTHING to stop child pornography. It's a stupid, pointless and expensive PR exercise that will do NOTHING to stop Child Pornography and pedophilia, because people who want that kind of thing will circumvent any and all methods used to stop them.

I have 3 questions for these people:

Is the Australian Government going to stop the sale of video and DVD players, because that's what the majority of child pornography is still circulated on?

Is the Australian Government going to stop the sale of video cameras and digital cameras - this is what the majority of child pornography is filmed on?

Is the Australian Government going to dismantle capitalism, the process which allows individuals to buy and sell goods and services for cash, because that's why the majority of Child Pornography rings run - people want it, others supply it for cash?
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 1:23pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Should ban all roads as well. After all, if people can't drive between two places that hugely reduces the risk of them being able to get somewhere where they could exchange child porn or do something else that's 'illegal'.
oliI am the
Posts: 6,101
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 1:37pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Footpaths, waterways, bridges, airports, and telephones while we're at it. Get rid of the postal service as well. It's very risky to have these things!

Ban speaking as well, just to avoid the risk of people talking about other ways to exchange anything.

Have to protect the children!
NoddyPosts: 9,559
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 2:11pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Too much banning Oli. It will never happen.

Only one thing needs to be banned to protect us from this evil....... CHILDREN!
Testing the limits of the human heart since 1973.
StrykeSuper Hyper-Mega
Posts: 6,118
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 2:14pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia

 :lol:

 
When I die. I want to be frozen. And if they have to freeze me in pieces, so be it. I will wake up stronger than ever, because I will have used that time, to figure out exactly why I died. And what moves I could have used to defend myself better now that I know what hold he had me in.
NoddyPosts: 9,559
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 2:21pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
If those little sluts weren't going around tempting us with their soft skin and lack of pubic hair then people wouldn't be tempted.

BAN THEM NOW!
Testing the limits of the human heart since 1973.
EzPosts: 4,532
Posted: 25 Nov 2008, 4:45pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
 :rofl:
bezzPosts: 956
Posted: 30 Nov 2008, 10:34amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Here's an official petition i found while looking at the 'no australian internet censorship' facebook group:

The Official Petition is now available to download at:
http://www.wakinggiant.org/au_censorship.htm

Let's make this Viral!!

We need at least 20,000 signatures to make an impact, this would equal the same amount of signatures on the original petition that started this barbaric idea, 20,000 well meaning but mis-informed religious activists.

This has been available for 24 hours and over 300 people have already downloaded this and promise to get as many signatures as they can, each and every person's support is invaluable to making our case solid, for those of you that are attending the Melbourne protest on the 29th, will be able to give me the signatures that they have collected there, otherwise there are postal details in the petition.

deathmazePosts: 3,010
Posted: 4 Dec 2008, 3:16pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
GetUp! organises advertising blitz to protest internet filter

A BACKLASH against plans to censor Australia's internet is gathering momentum as disgruntled web users organise petitions, protests and an online advertising blitz.

Online advocacy group GetUp! today launched a fundraising drive to display a series of advertisements protesting the Rudd Government's mandatory web filtering plan on major news websites.

"Australia's internet is about to be censored," the web ads read. They click through to GetUp!'s "Save The Net" petition, which already has more than 75,000 signatories.

For a $25 donation, the ads will be shown to 1800 people on "websites internet users see everyday", while a $100 donation will mean they are seen by 10,000 people, the group said.

"How broadly and how long we can run the ads for depends on how much money we can raise," said GetUp! national director Simon Sheikh.

"That's why we're calling on all Australians who disagree with (Communications Minister Stephen) Conroy's censorship plans to chip in."

Since being launched this afternoon, the drive has already raised more than $10,000.

Meanwhile, thousands of users on social networking website Facebook have flagged their intention to attend protests against the filtering plan in cities across the country.

The protests, to be held on December 13, have been organised by the Digital Liberty Coalition, a collection of anti-censorship groups including GetUp! and the Electronic Freedom Project.

Opponents of the Government's filtering scheme are concerned the system will slow internet speed and accidentally block a large number of legitimate websites.

In the first of three annual reports made for Senator Conroy's office published earlier this year, the Australian Communications and Media Authority cited studies that had found web filters blocked the wrong content in more than 25 per cent of test cases.

Anti-censorship advocates are also concerned that a secret "blacklist" of websites to be blocked could be expanded in the future to include political material.

The Government says an internet filter is necessary to clamp down on illegal material such as child pornography and protect young people on the web, but has struggled to convince all parties.

Last month it was reported that even some children's welfare groups were opposed to the plan, with concerns that money put aside for a web filter could be better spent elsewhere.

"This is called a child protection measure yet the vast majority of all serious child abuse does not occur on the internet, it occurs in the home," said James McDougall of the National Children's and Youth Law Centre.

A live trial of web filtering technology to censor a blacklist of up to 10,000 websites is scheduled to begin before Christmas.

Links
GetUp! advertising campaign – http://www.getup.org.au/campaign/SaveTheNet&id=465
Digital Liberty Coalition – http://nocensorship.info/main/
Welfare groups slam filter plans – http://www.smh.com.au/news/technology/childrens-w....
This article or section is in need of attention from an expert on the subject.
delPosts: 2,549
Posted: 16 Dec 2009, 8:39pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Nothing just yet I suspect. Following the links from Simon's post, most of the other government bodies seem opposed to the idea at the moment, and it still needs to get through parliment - so hopefully the opposition parties get on the case. Good reason to write a letter before that happens though.

If it does, sites will be banned based on the Australian Communications and Media Authority (ACMA) blacklist of sites - with a discusion paper just released on how additions to the list will occur, but at the moment come from complaints. With the way people complain about ads in Aus, that could end up being a looong list.



Was just thinking before that the government recently launched its plan to spend billions to have fibre optical cable replace the old copper cable network by 2016 or 2018 - and now this?!
headachePosts: 4,989
Posted: 16 Dec 2009, 8:57pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Was just thinking before that the government recently launched its plan to spend billions to have fibre optical cable replace the old copper cable network by 2016 or 2018 - and now this?!

Read this.

Quote from: Mark Newton
Conroy has spent two years telling Australia that the only important factor that would justify or inhibit a censorship regime was network performance. Why, then, did his trial fail to test network performance at any speed faster than 8 megabits per second? Since April, Conroy has been touting a National Broadband Network which runs at 100 megabits per second — over 12 times faster than the fastest speed tested by Enex testlab. None of the trial’s technical specs, published in Appendix 1 of the report, approach that speed. Most of them actually show notable “flat-spots” between 7 and 8 megabits per second that are indicative of bottlenecks.

What is the nature of those bottlenecks? We don’t know because the report doesn’t tell us. So we’re now confronted with the prospect of a Government marching into a 100 megabit future — with absolutely no idea whether their mandatory censorship system will be able keep up.

Face Palm

NoddyPosts: 8,886
Posted: 16 Dec 2009, 10:35pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Will hard house & trance be on the banned list?

If so, internet censorship is getting my vote.
Testing the limits of the human heart since 1973.
DirtyRohanAKA - Rogue
Posts: 529
Posted: 16 Dec 2009, 10:41pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Will hard house & trance be on the banned list?

If so, internet censorship is getting my vote.

+1
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Scratching on CDJ's is like driving a skyline - you think it's cool, but ultimately you're just a retard.

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FunkyJPromoters
Posts: 4,154
Posted: 17 Dec 2009, 8:23amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I'd suggest you do make complaints about websites with that type of music, Noddy.

I'm going to make constant complaints about political websites such as ALP.org.au, because it will tie them up so much as to be essentially ineffective.

That's what I'm hoping, anyway.
delPosts: 2,549
Posted: 17 Dec 2009, 7:11pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
I was interested to read that even the people who are thinking about the children, think this is a stupid idea:

Quote
The Australian
Annie Pettitt of Save the Children had concerns about the government's filtering plan.

"In particular we have concerns that an ISP filter will potentially lull families into a false sense of security . . . when in fact, they may not be aware of what their children may be doing on the internet and its much better to have parents and children educated about the safety of internet use."


Awesome, thanks Spank. For the first time ever, I'll be writing a letter I reckon.

Did this too. Wrote an email to Conroy, the shadow minister, Xenephon and fuck it, even Family First!

Here's a template from a website from Spanks link posted earlier if you feel the need as I did - I put my address (Labrina last place I voted) at the bottom so they know it's a registered voter and not just spam too:



Dear Minister,

As an Australian and an internet user, I have serious concerns about your mandatory Internet filtering initiative.

Given the importance your Government has attached to modernising Australia's broadband network, pursuing a policy that can only slow down and increase the costs of home internet access seems misguided at best. Australian households are diverse, and most do not have young children, so mandating a one-size-fits-all clean feed approach will not serve the public well. I don't think it is the Government's role to decide what's appropriate for me or my children, and neither do most Australians.

Given the amount of Internet content available, the Government will never be able to classify it all and filters will always result in an unacceptable level of over-blocking. I feel that the time and money could be spent in better ways both to protect children and improve Australia's digital infrastructure. Australian parents need better education about the risks their children face online. Trying to rid the Internet of adult content is futile, and can only distract from that mission.

Sincerely,

Internet User

City, State
delPosts: 2,549
Posted: 18 Dec 2009, 10:07pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
After some more reading on nocleanfeed.com, I find it hard to believe that even if the Government do get this through with the very little research they've done, it will be such a colossal failure (complaints over speed, rising cost for consumers, large maintenance costs for the government) that it wont be in place for long.

I'm hoping anyway.
headachePosts: 4,989
Posted: 18 Dec 2009, 10:27pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
For that to happen it would mean the Government would have to admit they were wrong.
delPosts: 2,549
Posted: 18 Dec 2009, 10:41pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Haha yea, good point. Got more chance of getting Josh into a federal seat to voice his opinions.
khemAdministrator
Posts: 11,393
Posted: 25 Feb 2010, 5:24pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Conroy's website removes references to filter

http://www.news.com.au/technology/conroys-website-removes-references-to-filter/

THE minister in charge of the Government's web censorship plan has been caught out censoring his own website.

The front page of Communications Minister Stephen Conroy's official website displays a list of topics connected to his portfolio, along with links to more information about each one.

All the usual topics are there – cyber safety, the national broadband network, broadcasters ABC and SBS, digital television and so on.

All except one.

It was revealed today a script within the minister's homepage deliberately removes references to internet filtering from the list.

In the function that creates the list, or "tag cloud", there is a condition that if the words "ISP filtering" appear they should be skipped and not displayed.


The discovery is unlikely to do any favours for Senator Conroy's web filtering policy, which has been criticised for its secrecy.

According to Google's cache records, the exception has been included on the minister's homepage since at least February 14.

A message on the page says it was last updated in October last year.

Melbourne web developer David Johnson confirmed to news.com.au that the code was intended to remove references to internet filtering.

"The code is a quick fix," said Mr Johnson of creative agency Lemonade.

"If the developers of the minister’s site had wanted to do it properly they would have placed the 'ISP filtering' keyword exclusion on the server side where it is inaccessible to the public, instead of the front-end code which can be seen by anyone and understood by people with even a basic knowledge of scripting."

The function, written in web scripting language Javascript, appears to have been first discovered by a user on the Whirlpool broadband discussion forum.

Senator Conroy's office has been contacted for comment.

more info: http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=1391908#r1

laugh

delPosts: 3,132
Posted: 29 Mar 2010, 7:52amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
US reveals concerns over Conroy’s net filter plan

The Obama administration has questioned the Rudd Government’s plan to introduce an internet filter on the grounds that it runs contrary to stated US foreign policy of using an open internet to spread economic growth and global security.

The US State Department has told The Punch its officials have raised concerns about the filter with Australian counterparts, as America mounts a new diplomatic assault on internet censorship by governments worldwide.

Asked about the US view on the filter plan US State Department spokesman Noel Clay said: “The US and Australia are close partners on issues related to cyber matters generally, including national security and economic issues.

“We do not discuss the details of specific diplomatic exchanges, but can say that in the context of that ongoing relationship, we have raised our concerns on this matter with Australian officials.”

Rest of the article here
GlockPosts: 8,655
Posted: 29 Mar 2010, 9:16pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Let's hope they threaten free trade agreements and all that to put pressure on the government to scrap it.

What with the whole Atkinson resignation lately, if this happened as well, everything would be looking really sweet!
khemAdministrator
Posts: 14,462
Posted: 7 Apr 2010, 6:18pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
looks like the uk is next

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010/mar/22/digital-economy-bill

Reducing online piracy and copyright theft

By far the most contentious part of the bill and the source of huge popular opposition. The DEB adds a clause to the Communications Act 2003 that says that ISPs must provide "copyright owners" (defined murkily in the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act's section 173 with details (though not identities) of copyright infringers. Quite possibly, anyone could claim to be a copyright owner.

As altered, the bill now allows for ISPs to be required to block access to sites that allow "substantial" infringement. One of Lord Mandelson's principal targets here – urged on by the BPI and Federation Against Copyright Theft and Federation Against Software Theft – is "cyberlocker" sites that let people store files, or move them between two people easily, which, lobbyists argue, allows widespread copyright infringement. The argument then becomes how you tell whether a cyberlocker is being used for substantial infringement. But as they don't publicise their contents (they are like safe deposit boxes for the web), how can it be determined whether they are substantially infringing?

One site that would immediately be trapped by this provision is Wikileaks – which exists solely to republish leaked, and hence copyrighted, work. Would a Trafigura-like company in the future use the DEB to shut off UK access to the site if something embarrassing appeared there?

The bill allows for the "temporary suspension" of internet connections for those deemed to have allowed multiple copyright infringement after warnings from their ISPs (who are required to maintain "copyright infringement reports" on users, anonymously). Hotels and businesses that offer free or paid-for Wi-Fi have expressed serious concerns that they would have to shut such services down.

The record industry is happy with the proposals, but many citizens aren't: in two days more than 10,000 people had contacted their MP via the 38 Degrees site to express concern and demand proper debate of the proposals.

A "proper" debate would take so long it would kill the bill – although Harriet Harman, the leader of the Commons, did suggest in a tweet that it will get "debate". The Tories, however, seem to be in favour.

Status: Alive, and likely to survive wash-up.

delPosts: 3,132
Posted: 13 Apr 2010, 10:50amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Australia should drop filter plan: US
    * Fran Foo
    * From: Australian IT
    * April 13, 2010 10:52AM

CHILD pornographers can be captured and prosecuted without having to resort to mandatory internet filters, says Barack Obama confidante and US Ambassador to Australia Jeff Bleich.

The Rudd government has said the mandatory filters are crucial in its arsenal of online weapons aimed at stamping out child pornography and other forms of illegal material.

Asked on ABC TV's Q&A program last night whether the proposed internet filter threatened both the US-Australia relationship, Mr Bleich expressed confidence both governments would be able to find "the path forward", but didn't explain where that road led.

Australia had been made aware of his government's no internet censorship stance, he said, adding that the US has had "healthy discussions" with its Australian counterparts on the matter.

"On the issue of the internet we have been very clear. The internet needs to be free," Mr Bleich said. "It needs to be free the way we have said skies have to be free, outer space has to be free, the polar caps have to be free, the oceans have to be free. They're shared resources of all the people in the world.

"To the extent that there are disagreements (about) trying to find the right balance between law enforcement and respecting that general principle, we work with our friends, and so we've been working with Australia on this issue, we've had healthy discussions and ... I'm sure we'll be able to find the path forward."

The US had told Australia child pornographers could be nabbed without the use of internet filters, Mr Bleich said.

"What we've said is we have been able to accomplish the goals that Australia has described, which is to capture and prosecute child pornographers and others who use the internet for terrible purposes, without having to use internet filters," he said.

"We have other means and we are willing to share our efforts with them in order to allow them to at least look at a range of choices as opposed to moving in one particular direction ... It's an ongoing conversation."

More here
khemAdministrator
Posts: 14,462
Posted: 9 May 2010, 11:44amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
UK downloading prohibited   

The government forced through the controversial digital economy bill with the aid of the Conservative party last night, attaining a crucial third reading – which means it will get royal assent and become law – after just two hours of debate in the Commons.

Earlier the government removed its proposed clause 18, which could have given it sweeping powers to block sites, but replaced it with an amendment to clause 8 of the bill. The new clause allows the secretary of state for business to order the blocking of "a location on the internet which the court is satisfied has been, is being or is likely to be used for or in connection with an activity that infringes copyright".

A new law in the UK now means that ISP's in Britain will be forced to feed information to the government about our actions online. ISP's will be forced to disconnet users who infringe upon copyright for fears of being fined up to £250,000 if they do not and ISP's will also be forced upon the secretary of states say so to completely block sites like this and many others from UK access.

For me this means an end to life as I know it and I think you will agree sucks balls.

Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2010/apr/08/digital-economy-bill-passes-third-reading

beilPosts: 137
Posted: 9 May 2010, 12:39pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Grim, and I thought the internet over here sucked balls.. atleast we can still download stuff and not worry about being 'reported for copyright infringement'... yet..
JayarPromoters
Posts: 3,465
Posted: 9 May 2010, 2:44pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
For me this means an end to life as I know it and I think you will agree sucks balls.

really? what so you go back to the days of buying CDs and hiring dvds from the local shop? icon_wink

as much as i hate this level of government meddling regarding censorship, I cant see that limiting illegal downloads is going to hurt me much (unless some stupid knock ons elsewhere as per the filter...)
Data, Friday Feb 18th @ Winstons
DZ & Chasing Shadows, Sat Apr 9 @ L!ve
More TBA!

Art + Bass (Fringe exhibition) March 2 (& 3 -13) Austral Hotel Bunka

Live @ Void, Sydney mix: LINK

1994-2006 D&B vinyl sale - classics, well looked after and priced to sell!

THE BASSBIN: Dubstep radio with Jayar & Desh, Fresh 92.7, 10pm Thur
khemAdministrator
Posts: 14,462
Posted: 9 May 2010, 6:09pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
that was a copy and paste job, not my words

teef

im sure there will be ways around whatever measures are put in place, always have been, always will be...

JayarPromoters
Posts: 3,465
Posted: 25 May 2010, 2:46pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
loved how easy it was for pakistan to block youtube, facebook, wikipedia etc all in aid of 'Everybody draw Mohammed day' last week.

lol, you can smell the burning effigies from here!
Data, Friday Feb 18th @ Winstons
DZ & Chasing Shadows, Sat Apr 9 @ L!ve
More TBA!

Art + Bass (Fringe exhibition) March 2 (& 3 -13) Austral Hotel Bunka

Live @ Void, Sydney mix: LINK

1994-2006 D&B vinyl sale - classics, well looked after and priced to sell!

THE BASSBIN: Dubstep radio with Jayar & Desh, Fresh 92.7, 10pm Thur
Pseudo CoupPosts: 2,528
Posted: 25 May 2010, 9:14pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
loved how easy it was for pakistan to block youtube, facebook, wikipedia etc all in aid of 'Everybody draw Mohammed day' last week.

lol, you can smell the burning effigies from here!

http://iowahawk.typepad.com/iowahawk/2010/05/why-i-wont-be-participating-in-draw-m-day-pbuh.html
"There is a most absurd and audacious method of reasoning avowed by some bigots and enthusiasts, and through fear assented to by some wiser and better men; it is this. They argue against a fair discussion of popular prejudices, because, say they, tho' they would be found without any reasonable support, yet the discovery might be productive of the most dangerous consequences. Absurd and blasphemous notion."
JayarPromoters
Posts: 3,465
Posted: 26 May 2010, 9:52pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Data, Friday Feb 18th @ Winstons
DZ & Chasing Shadows, Sat Apr 9 @ L!ve
More TBA!

Art + Bass (Fringe exhibition) March 2 (& 3 -13) Austral Hotel Bunka

Live @ Void, Sydney mix: LINK

1994-2006 D&B vinyl sale - classics, well looked after and priced to sell!

THE BASSBIN: Dubstep radio with Jayar & Desh, Fresh 92.7, 10pm Thur
John LPosts: 3,036
Posted: 18 Jun 2010, 5:10pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Hahaha

That is awesome.

Good on them
Get off my lawn.
m.r.third-eyesustainablility unit
Posts: 1,601
Posted: 22 Jun 2010, 11:00pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
six of the most important reasons why the internet shouldn't be censored...
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/bigideas/stories/2010/06/22/2932552.htm
it'll be on abc tomorrow morning, if not, grab the full clip here
>>> http://mpegmedia.abc.net.au/tv/bigideas/fora_davideagleman_full.mp4
music  ( @ Klute ) http://www.4shared.com/audio/aXcSm8L-/bennieraw_4_6_10_1.html
 NEW! >> ( @ Subsects) http://www.mediafire.com/?n9a83wz900uf5b1
don't think about it, just feel it...
FunkyJPosts: 4,503
Posted: 6 Aug 2010, 8:51pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Coalition to dump flawed internet filter

"Asked if the Coalition would vote in favour of Labor's internet filtering policy in the Federal Parliament if it didn't win the election, Mr Hockey said they wouldn't.

Even if Labor wins the election on August 21 the filter appears doomed.

A second term Gillard government wouldn't have the numbers required to pass its legislation."

So... what if it did win election? Would it pass something equally as pathetic?

My crystal balls say yes.
bezzPosts: 956
Posted: 7 Aug 2010, 8:18amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
So... what if it did win election? Would it pass something equally as pathetic?

My crystal balls say yes.

Apparently they want to bring back the free NetNanny software for those who want it deal.
GlockPosts: 9,850
Posted: 7 Aug 2010, 10:38amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
Apparently they want to bring back the free NetNanny software for those who want it deal.

As well they should! That's the best option and always has been. Put the responsibility onto the user, if you want to censor, you can choose what to censor. Include the infamous blacklist set up into the program and those who wanted the filter can have it.
dubbdPosts: 2,314
Posted: 12 Aug 2010, 5:54pmSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
the libs wanna scrap the NBN though... haven't they started rolling that out already?
Thou shalt not use poetry, art or music to get into girls pants | Use it to get into their heads.
StrykeSuper Hyper-Mega
Posts: 6,118
Posted: 14 Apr 2011, 9:11amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia

 Ouch. Sure if you are tech savvy you will be able to dodge it ( Encrypting your torrents etc)

 It is kinda hard to make arguments against these types of bills, though you can certainly argue that there will be issues regarding proof of who downloaded what etc.

 'Hey you are removing my right to steal' :lol:
When I die. I want to be frozen. And if they have to freeze me in pieces, so be it. I will wake up stronger than ever, because I will have used that time, to figure out exactly why I died. And what moves I could have used to defend myself better now that I know what hold he had me in.
Pseudo CoupPosts: 2,698
Posted: 14 Apr 2011, 10:08amSubject: Re: Internet censorship in Australia
"There is a most absurd and audacious method of reasoning avowed by some bigots and enthusiasts, and through fear assented to by some wiser and better men; it is this. They argue against a fair discussion of popular prejudices, because, say they, tho' they would be found without any reasonable support, yet the discovery might be productive of the most dangerous consequences. Absurd and blasphemous notion."